Dog Park
Last time we talked about this issue, it was all the way back at Handbook of Heroes #1. Taking your horse into a dungeon still prompts debate, but I think there’s a separate class of animal husbandry problems that crop up when you deal with huge-sized critters.
Whether you’ve got an elephant, an allosaurus, or a baluchitherium on staff, you’ve got some real mechanical headaches coming your way when you go adventuring with Dumbo. First of all you’ve got to dust off the old squeezing rules. Then you’ve got to remember how trample and overrun work. How big can you be if you want to occupy your oversize ally’s space? How do you count a mounted combatant’s reach? What do howdahs do again?
And let’s not even get started on the weirdness of large creatures getting pinned into tight spaces. If I had a nickle for every time I’ve seen the party arranged on the grid such that my poor dragons can’t take a legal move, I’d have like, three or four nickles. Shit comes up is what I’m saying.
But worse than the mechanics is the fictional chore list. Feeding your fantasy SUV is a constant drain on the GP. Not to mention the hassle of finding reliable stabling. Then there’s the collateral damage if it gets spooked in a thunder storm. The difficulty of travel via vehicles. The enormous poo-bags you have to carry on walks. It all adds up to a pain-in-the-butt that the mammoth rider prestige class can’t quite make up for.
So for our question of the day, what do you say we compare notes on the big fat beasts in our lives? How do you handle uncomfortably large minis on the battle mat? How about the logistics of big critters in town or down in the dungeon? Sound of with your strategies for handling inconveniently enormous mounts, animal companions, and monsters down in the comments!
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You don’t.
There is no strategy only suffering.
That and a bag of holding filled with poo.
“Sack o’ crap” sounds like a much less magical item.
That or a very unhappy bag of devouring.
Bless you. This made my day.
It’s not often I have reason to say this, but what you need is an otyugh.
Bag of Everlasting Dung! Farmers and pranksters both would treasure it.
https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/a-b/bag-of-everlasting-dung/
It has only ever come up once in my experience, and this is how it breaks down:
Animal Companions can follow me if they’re physically capable, and matters of defending great heights or sheer cliffs were case-by-case. More often than not it was simply a straight athletics check to climb, as they normally would incur disadvantage but I’d always try and aid them. If put into a space where they’re squeezing, disadvantaged on attacks and skills, and enemies had advantage against them. As for the battle map, if I’m mounting than my mini simply becomes said giant mount.
We went vaguely square cube law as far as food supplies go. A medium beast can sustain itself for the day on one (designed for animals) ration. A large size creature needs at least two, and each size above that doubles. Just as well any ability, spell, or feature in which something can feed X amount of creatures, my companion naturally takes up Y amount. Though I got around this via Goodberry. As for stables, I usually just slept in said stables or just alongside my beastie boy. Helped that I invested in a wagon so We save money on rooms by sleeping in the wagon.
What exactly was the critter?
Does that allosaurus have a name? I’m sure I recall seeing one in an earlier comic, but can’t find it right now, and it’s not the one referenced.
Her name is Allie.
so that’s what Ring Gates where invented for.
I don’t follow.
I don’t think you want to…
And I doubt the creature would approve…
easy way to dispose of dropping within a 100 mile radius of the receiving end.
no Will, you don’t want to install them: Droppings go to the farm, food comes back.
my current game, well he isn’t a pet but i have a unique treant guardian. he is huge size now. pretty much any building is a no-go and while he is powerful and has some cool abilities, he simply cant fit in so many dungeon entrances. though i think i just plot-unlocked the ability to summon him around, so maybe if things open up into a larger space i can pull him in. mid-levels was also rough because he was big enough and we were low level enough that we had to use two teleport spells to get anywhere.
Build a tree house in his branches. Mobile base!
at low level i did climb up in him and use him as an archery platform XD
I havent yet encountered that situation as a DM, but I’d probably rule depending on the creature. A spider, snake, or other flexible creature? Yeah they can fit through a space smaller than their grid size. Something big and bulky like a minotaur? Not gonna happen. Not easily at least. I might even give the creature the chance to break through the narrow passage if it’s like a small doorway.
I dig that Kool-Aid Man solution.
Construct!
There, all settled. No fuss. No muss.
Bonus points for making it collapsible. Or naming it “Kit”.
I’ve always wanted to try out being the construct: https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/o/object-possession/
I’ve always seen pet maintenance handwaved. I’m a stickler as a player, but I’ve either not purchased a mount (I just hitch a cart to someone else’s steed and let them worry) or play a Paladin whose steed can be left unsupervised and can just much grass when I’m not watching.
You mean you don’t play Mount Simulator™ with your D&D? For shame!
I did GM a group that had a Druid with a Large Amargasaurus dinosaur (see here in his own in-character drawing https://i.imgur.com/ivYFDuD.jpg and in the middle of his player’s slightly better drawing https://i.imgur.com/YGavfRY.jpg ). Didn’t run into too many problems once the Druid freed him from the dinosaur smuggler ship – the party was on a deserted, cursed island for the whole campaign (so no towns to go to) and all of the underground hallways were at least two squares wide. The Druid also used the spell Carry Companion ( https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/c/carry-companion/ ) to, in effect, return Deeno to his pokeball for obstacles like the 60-ft ladder. We never really had any serious issues with this setup – the party needed a “Fighter” anyways (though the NPC Steve the Torcherer did eventually get some Fighter levels to enhance his ability to beat things with torches), and Deeno did stuff like carry the hog-tied prisoner they had so the rest of the party didn’t need to deal with it. Being an herbivore, we could just say he ate leaves, though the island’s plantlife probably wasn’t great for him. It was only a couple of in-universe days. I’m sure his stomach was fine.
And the mini was so fun! https://i.imgur.com/r8C94Qa.jpg
The art’s OK, but that mini is exceptional. You should do a KickStarter. 😛
Carry companion and the hosteling armor are cool for exactly this reason. Of course, I think that size-large creatures are slightly easier to manage than their huge+ brethren. I guess it matters too whether you’re doing a wilderness game or an urban adventure.
Yeah, our minis collection was pretty great. Sometimes, their high quality and uniqueness can cause a bit of confusion, unless you take the appropriate steps to keep everything straight.
https://i.imgur.com/IKlxcZk.jpg
Oh man… I originally pitched that comic to Laurel. I asked her to draw Fighter like a monopoly piece, Cleric like a coin, Thief like a cardboard standy, and Wizard as a Lego man. She thought it wouldn’t fit her style, which is a shame on account of the concept still gives me the giggles.
Happily, we did wind up with a comic out of the idea:
https://www.handbookofheroes.com/archives/comic/proxy
Well in a game a while ago my Rogue got many problems to squeeze his kraken companions in many places. Leaving him behind wasn’t an option. He would get hungry and start eating sailors without my Rogue being present and without sharing with him. As the rest of the party said that was a heartwarming but strangely disturbing father and son moment between the two 🙂
Well now I’ve just got to know: What’s the weirdest place you managed to fit your kraken? ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
First of all,and this is something i needed to get straight back in that game, it wasn’t my Rogue’s kraken. That makes it looks like he was a pet. He was my Rogue’s son, quite literally, he bore him as a tadpole. Now as for the weirdest places i put him: Do you remember that scene in the first Pirates of The Caribbean when Jack Sparrow “docks” his shipwreck to the docks? Well my rogue, who used to use his son as maritime transport method did something alike. With even a person asking him the tariff for docking his kraken to the docks. Much later in the game when Kraken died he used Reincarnate to return him to life as a tadpole. Then my Rogue carried him in his water bottle. Which lead straight to an occasion in which the Paladin of the group drinks the water kraken’s tadpole included and got chocking on him. Luckily we could save him, and the Paladin too but he deserved getting chock for drinking another party member’s water and son 😀
Had a Druid who caught flak due to her horse sized wolf. I fixed the problem through copious use of a wand of Spider climb, which horrified my GM. ^.^ Mainly cause of the mental image of Sasha making bite attacks from the ceiling.
And I was forbidden from having a pet Rancor in the Star Wars game, despite the fact that I was effectively going down the Witches of Dathomir force path. Something about it not fitting in the ship and teaching it to use a spear being a surface to air weapon…
I think the idea of animals on ceilings is inherently funny:
https://www.handbookofheroes.com/archives/comic/altered-bestiary
Now if you can give spider climb to your Rancor, that’s just comedy gold.
There’s also the whole “they don’t level up with the PCs so eventually they’re just going to incidentally die from an AOE that wasn’t particularly concerned with them”.
I tend to go for summoned creatures for this reason. Find Steed and it’s higher level version are my favorites… though you do have to hope your GM will just allow other options for the sake of variety.
Of course it’s also an issue on the GM side if you use the kind of “I am extremely lazy” google spreadsheet maps I use. Which is that any creature that takes up more than one space is extra work to deal with and it’s a lot easier to just say “yes PCs your mounts are technically large but I’m going to just treat their size on the map as medium to avoid this being an ALWAYS hassle”.
I love the durability of the 5e “find” spells. You actually get to use your companions rather than worrying that they’re just going to explode. Of course, that does come with its own problems:
https://www.handbookofheroes.com/archives/comic/unfamiliar
I haven’t seen it often, but the funniest time was in a published adventure.
My party gave 4th ed a test run (and we didn’t really enjoy it, but thats not due to this issue), and the first adventure we tried was the module in the core books. Can’t remember much about it, except it ended coming face to face with a Green Dragon. I had my doubts about the encounter, but new system, got to run it RAW before breaking out the mods and house rules, so I trusted the module and ran it as presented.
It was a blood bath, the Dragon tore its way through the party. and all that was left was a single (I think) Ranger, running for his life. He didn’t have much hope, until he hit the normal dungeon-width corridors. Suddenly the squeeze rules put a serious damper on the Dragons day – by the time I realised how screwed the Dragon was, the Ranger was now far more mobile, and was hit and running around corridor roners, whittling the Dragon down with a rain of arrows. Dragon dead, party survived, but I’m not entirely sure that was how the fight was meant to go (and to this day, I have no idea how a 1st level party was supposed to win that encounter otherwise).
Props for the kiting.
I’m not familiar with the 4e squeezing rules. Do you remember what the penalties were like?
Sadly not, as I long ago ebayed the books away. I believe it may have limited the squeezing character/monster to either a move or an action, and reduced the movement rate (so as long as the ranger kept at range, the Dragon couldn’t get an attack on him). It still left the ranger in some danger due to the Breath Weapon, but I never rolled well enough for it to recharge (in 4th ed, every ‘strong’ ability had a recharge value – you rolled a D6 each turn, and the ability came back to use if the required number or above was rolled), and I believe the character had an ability that allowed him to move after an attack, so was frequently ducking back around corners after his attack.
For Pathfinder, the spell Carry Companion has been a godsend. Stabling? Feeding? HAH! Just store your tyrannosaurus as a small stone figuring in your pocket until you need him. He doesn’t age or get hungry, and gets all the sleep he needs.
Currently looking into a Dire Collar to make him even bigger and beefier than he currently is, and thinking about getting him enchanted armour in the long term. Nothing excessive, but some masterwork parade armour with a decent enchantment would be good for him while my halfling Hunter hides and supports her frontliner from afar.
For familiars, I’ve always favored this thing as an option:
https://www.aonprd.com/EquipmentMiscDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Familiar%20satchel
You have a halfling hunter too? Those are fun to play. Mine had a boar that she rode into battle.
Pathfinder added so-called ‘metagame artifacts’ to tackle the issue presented in this comic. It’s DM-granted and it’s pretty much an in-universe excuse to have your companion where it wouldn’t logically fit in (socially or physically).
https://aonprd.com/MagicArtifactsDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Figurine%20of%20the%20Concealed%20Companion
Pathfinder 2e also has the ‘Collar of Inconspicusousness’ to handle the social/transport aspect of it. Fitting your gargantuan T-Rex into a dungeon is still iffy, though.
https://2e.aonprd.com/Equipment.aspx?ID=405
Now see, I feel like that collar is a better solution to this design problem. The metagame artifact is a patch on this issue that requires you to invent the concept of “metagame artifacts.” In other words, it has to go outside the system, which introduces new complexity.
The collar is cheap enough to matter early (which is when you need it most). It exists as part of the magic item economy already in existence. And it gives you an adorable shoulder dinosaur. What’s not to love?
So far, I really haven’t had this problem. My hunter’s companion was a medium sized boar, although the GM did give me an item that could turn him large a few times a day. But I never used it outside of battle. And as for moving around, I got Wings of Flying in the form of a saddle so he could get anywhere he needed to go.
Currently, I’m playing an Eldritch Knight in a 5e game. He got the Find Familiar spell and got a lizard familiar. It can just climb up the wall if it needs to, or sit on someone’s shoulder.
The 60′ ladder boss is a very serious boss. Especially if it appears in a cramped dungeon where flying is impractical.
I am wondering how my character Tara is going to get her mule into the various dungeons. I had to give her one because she can only carry 38 pounds and her armor and weapons alone are 28.
Block and tackle and a companion to pull the rope.
At the end of the campaign, she was (if I’m remembering right) a Druid 9/Gunslinger 5/Mammoth Rider 6. Her name was an Elven jumble of incomprehensibility and apostrophes that I won’t bother attempting to spell. She was the captain of our scurvy crew of pirates (to be clear, she was another player’s character).
She had a whale companion. He was gigantic and capsized enemy ships for us. Fortunately since he was a whale and we were pirates, he’d always just stay near the ship when we went ashore and we never had to deal with the issue of bringing a big critter into town. He also basically feed himself on krill, and we had long ceased to use grid maps by that point in the group’s history. There were very few problems with the whale.
I applaud that choice. Because you know there will be land-locked dungeons on islands and such where you’re giving up a boatload of power. Super-interesting dynamic right there.